Leader question

[radioflyer]

Do any of you'se guys tie your own leaders? I'm not really talking about furled, which I know Rick and some others do. I'm talking like 9' tapered leaders. I've been buying knotless tapered leaders for a long time and am thinking about tying my own. Do the nailknot tools like the one that Froghair offers help at all? Any suggestions from your experiences?

Thanks in advance for any advice.

rf

[trent]

RF-

I'm pretty sure I remember Dustin and Ray saying they tie their own.

Personally, I like the look of having a fresh 9' tapered leader on with no wind knots, sort of like what it feels like after a hair cut and a shave (if I needed to shave and could still find a barber shop that did a straight razor shave). Then, I will immediately cast into the nearest tree.

I stocked up at the Warehouse, so I won't need to buy any or tie my own for a while. Plus, given that a new purchased leader probably costs less than one fly at a lot of fly shops, the cost/benefit equation hasn't gone to the side of tying my own yet.

[rstaight]

Radio,

I've tied my own leaders. Maxima makes about six leader kits. They come with the various diameter lines and line colors to build your own leaders as well as instructions.

I received a kit a couple of years ago from my wife for Christmas. It has 12, 27 yard spools of line ranging in diameter from 20 thousanths (.02) down to 3 thousanths (.003). That is 25lb test down to 1lb test. It also includes formulas for 2 through 9 wt lines on 7-1/2', 10', and 12' leaders.

The instructions show a blood knot instead of the nail knot. I did receive a blood knot tool also and I felt it was useless for building leaders.

A nail knot tool may also be cumbersome. You will have finished sections in a leader as short as 4".

On cost, if you break down the cost of the kit into the number of leaders possible, it is cheaper than purchasing tapered leaders. Are you going to be making alot of leaders?

You will be able to build leaders more suited for the situation. Since you also build rods, just think of the satisfaction when you land that first fish with a rod and leader you built and a fly that you tied! It's great!

[flyfishingpastor]

RF;

I know a lot of people build their own leaders and think they are great. I have fished a lot of handbuilt leaders and even tied a few of my own to try it out, but I never really liked them for 2 reasons:
1. I never really found the right combination for leader/rod/casting stroke that would turn the fly over as well as a knotless leader/furled leader. Could well be my casting stroke but it is what it is.
2. It didn't happen a lot, but I occasionally had trouble with them getting tangled - I don't need anything else to bugger up a tippet/leader!

Pat

[barryl]

I have tied my own leaders for years mostly do to cost. When I started fly fishing times were a bit leaner and it was a travel to get nice store bought tapered leaders. One of the first books I acquired starting out was "Fly Fishing Basics and Equipment". It gave about five formulas for different leaders. Over time I learned to supplement mono and floro fishing line to meet my needs. There are many different approaches and formulas but experimentation is cheap with these materials. For about twenty or thirty dollars of fishing line you can make enough leaders to last a life time (and give a bunch away to boot). One product that helps is "Knot Sense" It make for very strong knots and smooths out the roughness of knots. As far as knots go no special tools are required. Blood knots, double surgeons knots, and double surgeons loops or perfection loops is about all you will need for most applications. It's not that hard and once you learn you can tie different leaders for different conditions even stream side. I know Krebs gave some good basic set ups at one time on this site maybe he could repost them just to get you started. The main rule is larger to smaller ie, 25lb test(butt section) to 15lb test to 8lb test. This is a simple bass leader that works well for warm water.
P.S. The book "Fly Fishing Basics and Equipment" I have loaned out to many people to get them started over the years, the ones who are still active fly fishing all tie their own leaders.

[flyfishingpastor]

barryl;

Maybe the Knot Sense would make a difference. I have used it for 3 or 4 years to smooth the leader/line connection and never thought to use it on hand-tied leaders. But, wouldn't knot sense make it stiff at the "joints?"

Pat

[krebsie]

Radio
I tie all my own leaders. 4'- 3'- 2'- 12" to 24" tippet. That is the basic set up for all hand tied leaders on a floating line. Nail knot the 4' to the fly line, use a piece of the red tube off the WD-40 can to do the nail knot, I carry a piece in my wallet. Blood knot all the rest. You can adjust any and all the length to fit your situation. For example if your fishing a heavy wind resistant fly cut off the tippet and just tie to the 2' piece of your leader. If you need a soft long leader tie in a longer tippet. You'll know how it's going to work on the first cast. You can use any combination of line you choose, mono, floro., plant fiber ... For me personally I can't tell the difference between a store bought leader and one I tie myself. On salt I use 50# 30# 20# then a bite tippet of 14" of 50#. On my 2wt I use 12# 10# 6# tippet 2#,or 4#. You really can't do it wrong if you follow the 4,3,2, or there abouts and just keep the taper going.
One thing I have found out over the years is that you think there are right and wrong ways of doing everything, Not always the case. Like fly tying, there are NO RULES!! Only opinions! I have met a lot of people over the years that will tell you "This is how you have to do it" only to find out that there are 20 others that will tell you That guy is wrong, so ? Who is right?
"Have it your way" is a slogan that seem to fit very well. If it works for you DO IT! That is one of the things about fly tying and fly fishing that makes our sport so appealing. Yes there are things that work better than others but that doesn't mean that's how it's supposed to be done. Live a little, don't be afraid to experiment, you might just come up with a brand new way to do something. Or, you might not! Then don't blame me, please!
Krebsie

[barryl]

For the most part yes it does add some stiffness at the knot connection. But the knot is a stiff point on a hand tied leader any way. Also use it sparingly you don't want a big ball just a smooth knot. I have tried to tapper it a little and found it best just to use less.

[radioflyer]

Thanks everyone for the input. I'll try to tie a few and see what happens, but as Krebsie, Rick and Dustin will tell you after watching me tie flies, 'bumblefingers' will try anything once!

thanks again!